The only way to be heard is to scream

So, yesterday I posted this recently released survey where "Americans 50 Most Influential Churches" are named (and really, its just an opinion survey, not a scientific study or anything, but in this case, that ends up being more telling).  And I asked the question, "What are we missing because womens leadership is not valued the same way a man's leadership is?"

Today I ran across an interview of Dan Allender Eroticism, Fly Fishing, and Bad Metaphors where he gives a very interesting quote that goes along with yesterday's question very well.  The interviewer asks him, "Any theological underpinnings that you see in the church that nurture a context for a higher prevalence for abuse—perhaps in interpretation of scripture?" 

(A verrrrry interesting question in the context of this blog that sometimes talks about abuse issues, women and the church)

He answers...

I do think that one of the core issues is that historically a women’s voice, no matter what your theological convictions are about ordination or elders and so on, the fact that a women’s voice has been segmented from that which matters most.

Where in a family, where in the larger culture, is a women’s voice not only heard and honored but also allowed to play a significant role in helping form the direction of the community? That becomes in some sense a silencing that leads ongoing to stridency [on the part of women], because the only way to be heard is to scream, or a level of presumption that a women’s voice doesn’t have much power.

That just has to be acknowledged as part of a larger structure of why a women’s voice would not be heard when she says no…. because no is just presumed to be either a yes, that all you have to do is take advantage of to get what you wish. Or, even if it is a no, who cares?

I would suggest that when not one of the top 50 churches in America are pastored by women, one of the things we are missing is the idea that a woman's voice can have a significant role in giving direction to a community.  You don't even have to personally agree that women should be allowed to pastor, to see that when not one of those churches is led by a woman, the message is clear : women's voices are not as valued as men's voices in the church.  That trickles all the way down from the decision about who is going to be in official roles, to how men and women relate as friends and if men  are allowed to use women for their own desires. 

I am not saying that churches that allow women leaders do not have male members who take advantage of women. 

I am saying, that as a whole Christan community in America, our imaginations are still filled with the idea that men's voices are valued more.  And that affects us all, no matter what particular church you happen to go to. 

What are we missing when a large part of the Christian community has to scream (or manipulate through sexuality) to be heard?  What would those voices have the freedom to teach us if they didnt have to scream?

Comments

[DeAnza]

yes... jen it is a sad, sad thing that we don't listen and make way for the voice's of women. being a pastor i am constantly questioning-- where do i fit? and when and how will my voice be heard? it's truly exhausting and frustrating at times-- and i work in a church that acknowledges & affirms women in leadership.

just to add another dimension to the pot-- i saw the pastors who were displayed with their church name as most influential and it's sad to say it but it looks like a lot of white evangelicals to me. when will the church really embrace diversity? even if we say we have it doesn't reflect-- does it?

[Mariam]

My hope is that in the Church, which is in many ways in our most conservative social institution, will go the way of other institutions - like universities, where over half of graduate students are now women. I work at a university in a male-dominated field. 10 years ago we have 1 female faculty member and less than 5% of our students were female. Now there are 8 female faculty members and about 30% of our students are female. Women are over-represented among scholarship students (not because of affirmative action but because their grades are higher and they are more competitive) to the point that there are now programs in high schools addressing boys' lack of success.

In the church I attend (Anglican) it has only been in the past couple of decades that women have been ordained (and it is still an issue for some conservatives). But there are a LOT of female rectors now. It is only a matter of time before they move through the ranks - although one of the things that is a bit problematic (in terms of getting female representation at higher levels) is that women often come to ministry when they are older. I think there are a lot more women in ministry in Canada than the US but I think that is a reflection of US conservatism in general.

I agree that not having women in leadership positions in the churches sends a message to women that they are not as important as men. I think that what has changed attitudes in universities and business has been education. The change of female participation has been remarkable in just two decades. The change of attitude in society in general has been even more remarkable. My mother is a very old-fashioned conservative woman, who was submissive to my father and took on a traditional wife/mother role. It would have never occurred to her to do otherwise. But she is getting positively feminist in her old age. She began attending church only recently (also Anglican) and she told me the other day how sad she was that their female rector was being transferred. She said "I really hope the next one is a women too. I don't know why they had that stupid rule about women not being priests - they're a lot better at it than the men. For that matter I think they make better doctors too - and a lot of other things!" Since learning of my daughter's abuse and then later the number of other women who were sexually abused as children, often by pastors or church elders, my mother has developed quite a low opinion of men, and thinks very few of them are "fit" for ministry because they can't keep their hands to themselves. It is an interesting turnaround from the traditionalists who don't think women are "fit" for leadership positions in ministry because they are worried that they will "tempt" the men.

[Gary McCullough]

Check out the source of this top 50 list:

Rising Evangelical Star Jason Christy Leaves Trail of Fraud, Associates Say
By Hannah Elliott

SCOTTSDALE, Ariz. Aug. 1 /ABP/ -- When young, charismatic Christian publisher Jason Christy was tapped two years ago to lead the powerful Christian Coalition, the group's leaders praised him for his ability "to inspire and encourage people of faith to action." But Christy's business dealings -- both before and after his one-month affiliation with the Coalition -- instead have inspired former customers and co-workers to file lawsuits charging Christy with defrauding their Christian businesses.

Christy, 36, who apparently had no previous public-policy experience, persuaded the Christian Coalition in 2005 to place him in one of the most visible and powerful positions in evangelical life. But before the coalition's leaders officially turned over the reins of their 1.2 million-member national lobbying group, they learned of a trail of legal and financial problems that has followed Christy from coast to coast.

Former associates and customers of Christy's many business ventures -- mostly Christian magazines -- say he cheated them out of money and threatened them. At least 10 of them have filed lawsuits, Associated Baptist Press has learned, and others have gotten court-issued restraining or protection orders against the Scottsdale, Ariz., businessman.

Christy says all the allegations are false. He and his supporters say "enemies" are spreading lies about him because of soured business relationships. But critics say Christy is a scam artist preying on trusting Christians.

Christy now publishes The Church Report, supposedly a conservative, national print magazine and web site. He has appeared as an analyst on CNN and spoken at megachurches like Robert Schuller’s Crystal Cathedral. He hob-nobs with some of the evangelical elite and still has relationships with leaders in highly respected positions, like the Evangelical Council for Financial Accountability.

This article is continued at Associated Baptist Press News: http://www.abpnews.com/2685.article

Also at The Baptist Standard: http://www.baptiststandard.com/postnuke/index.php?module=htmlpages&func=display&pid=6646 and

Christianity Today: http://www.christianitytoday.com/ct/2007/augustweb-only/131-35.0.html

[Spiritbear]

I think the entire Church system must change or it will fold completely in 20 years. Sexism is only one problem but it pushes women (and men who love them) away.

Ask nonchristians what they think of Christians. Its very interesting

Btw. I love this blog. You have a lot of good things to say. Dont let the patriarchy silence you